Kidderminster match thread

[themaster]

Keep calm and carry on supporting. I am with Moonwatcher in saying there is far too much angst when things don't go our way. Firstly, regarding being gifted the league last year, we never lost two games in a row, whereas Fylde blew a big lead and lost (from memory) three in a row and got something like 2 points from 5 games. What's the saying about "slow and steady wins the race"? Unspectacular but consistent, got the job done, etc.

Right, turning to this season, Mr Casson made a rod for his own - and the team's - back by talking up our chances. Another saying that comes to mind is something like "promise low, deliver high". Having said that, we are muddling along in mid table and having some ups and downs, which isn't great, but could be worse. Results for most teams in the league have been strange - see results of Macclesfield v Barrow, Forest Green and Aldershot and our results v those teams.

I don't think the football is as bad as people make out. It is perceived as bad when the result is bad - and vice versa. There must be some question marks about signings and I certainly would like some explanation about why Mellor, Fofana and Grimes are only bit part players. If some of them are being left out because of attitude, perhaps we should release them, if possible contractually? In effect, we are largely operating with last season's title winning team - or we would be if Pilkington was fit. So, in that respect, mid table in a higher league is not all that bad.

I am not complacent, there are things that seem to be wrong. However, (though I hate the cliche) we are on a journey and it is still early days. PC said in a recent interview that he thought things might get worse before they get better, which is not a happy prospect, but I think we need to rein back on the impulse to throw criticism in all directions and give the management and players some time to sort things out.

I can see where your coming from and I agree to an extent but .. the football is bad , most of the time its a hoof up to Cook.

Now I don't expect us to play like Barcelona at all , and I'm more than aware at what level these players are, but now that we are fulltime I expected some sort of improvement in the footballing standard, so far we haven't seen any.

Thinking about it we've looked poor in midfield for over 2 seasons now, so we've either had a lot of bad midfielders or the way we train and asked is to play is the problem. I know which I think it is.

Mellor, as far as I know is injured with an ankle problem which is hampering his training and he's been carrying it all season.

Fofana just looks clueless so far.

Don't know much about Grimes , heard a few rumours about his training level not being great but it depends on what he is used to , I suppose if you are used to receiving the ball to feet but are now being asked to chase into the corners and pull the ball down out of the sky most of the time its going to take time to adjust.

It also frustrates me that Elliot Newby doesn't get much of a look in when we have some players like VDB/Symington (who have also been poor signings so far) keep getting selected ahead of him . You could also argue the toss about Brad Carroll not being selected yesterday too , but I've not seen much of him myself.

Paul Murray was another strange appointment.

From all this I think Edmo is struggling, his percentage ball tactics don't work as well in this league as the last, so in most games so far we are looking for a change of idea/system which doesn't happen and this is where we are coming up short so far this season. The Aldershot games stands out ,their centre back had Cook pocketed from the very first minute, yet we continued with the same tactic and wonder why things don't go our way.

It does make me wonder what Sheridan and Bayliss would have done with the greater resource available right now ....

[themaster]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ekbw1e098g

[Moonwatcher]

Don't talk absolute [SwearFilter],we won the league over the course of a season,won more points than any other team,not down to one goal or one game. You do talk garbage.

Bogle scored the penalty, Fylde dropped 2 points which was what we won the league by. It would have been down to goal difference.
Fyldes was better because they played actual football.

Thats factual not garbage young lady/man.

If you're determined to focus on key points that influenced the destiny of the championship, why don't you look at beating the best footballing side in the league - ie Guiseley - home and away? Why not single out Lewis Guy's excellent winner on a grim Tuesday night at Edgeley Park? How about the splendid away win at Solihull? The hammering of Chorley? Aaron Taylor's penalty save? Take away any of those key moments and we would have finished second. I suspect if that HAD happened it would have suited you better, because failure would have given you something tangible hang your tiresome pessimism on. Does Barrow AFC actually winning something really make you feel that uncomfortable? Only someone with a pathological obsession with the negative side of everything Barrow AFC do would choose to nominate Omar Bogle as the player who "won" the Conference North title. Go and find another club's forum to moan on. How about Telford's - they're having a REALLY gloomy time of it.

[mall]

Keep calm and carry on supporting. I am with Moonwatcher in saying there is far too much angst when things don't go our way. Firstly, regarding being gifted the league last year, we never lost two games in a row, whereas Fylde blew a big lead and lost (from memory) three in a row and got something like 2 points from 5 games. What's the saying about "slow and steady wins the race"? Unspectacular but consistent, got the job done, etc.

Right, turning to this season, Mr Casson made a rod for his own - and the team's - back by talking up our chances. Another saying that comes to mind is something like "promise low, deliver high". Having said that, we are muddling along in mid table and having some ups and downs, which isn't great, but could be worse. Results for most teams in the league have been strange - see results of Macclesfield v Barrow, Forest Green and Aldershot and our results v those teams.

I don't think the football is as bad as people make out. It is perceived as bad when the result is bad - and vice versa. There must be some question marks about signings and I certainly would like some explanation about why Mellor, Fofana and Grimes are only bit part players. If some of them are being left out because of attitude, perhaps we should release them, if possible contractually? In effect, we are largely operating with last season's title winning team - or we would be if Pilkington was fit. So, in that respect, mid table in a higher league is not all that bad.

I am not complacent, there are things that seem to be wrong. However, (though I hate the cliche) we are on a journey and it is still early days. PC said in a recent interview that he thought things might get worse before they get better, which is not a happy prospect, but I think we need to rein back on the impulse to throw criticism in all directions and give the management and players some time to sort things out.

I can see where your coming from and I agree to an extent but .. the football is bad , most of the time its a hoof up to Cook.

Now I don't expect us to play like Barcelona at all , and I'm more than aware at what level these players are, but now that we are fulltime I expected some sort of improvement in the footballing standard, so far we haven't seen any.

Thinking about it we've looked poor in midfield for over 2 seasons now, so we've either had a lot of bad midfielders or the way we train and asked is to play is the problem. I know which I think it is.

Mellor, as far as I know is injured with an ankle problem which is hampering his training and he's been carrying it all season.

Fofana just looks clueless so far.

Don't know much about Grimes , heard a few rumours about his training level not being great but it depends on what he is used to , I suppose if you are used to receiving the ball to feet but are now being asked to chase into the corners and pull the ball down out of the sky most of the time its going to take time to adjust.

It also frustrates me that Elliot Newby doesn't get much of a look in when we have some players like VDB/Symington (who have also been poor signings so far) keep getting selected ahead of him . You could also argue the toss about Brad Carroll not being selected yesterday too , but I've not seen much of him myself.

Paul Murray was another strange appointment.

From all this I think Edmo is struggling, his percentage ball tactics don't work as well in this league as the last, so in most games so far we are looking for a change of idea/system which doesn't happen and this is where we are coming up short so far this season. The Aldershot games stands out ,their centre back had Cook pocketed from the very first minute, yet we continued with the same tactic and wonder why things don't go our way.

It does make me wonder what Sheridan and Bayliss would have done with the greater resource available right now ....

I think Bayle's would have had us on the edge of the play offs with the resources and local talent that is now available.

[The Real Slim Azza]

Bogle scored the penalty, Fylde dropped 2 points which was what we won the league by. It would have been down to goal difference.
Fyldes was better because they played actual football.

Thats factual not garbage young lady/man.

If you're determined to focus on key points that influenced the destiny of the championship, why don't you look at beating the best footballing side in the league - ie Guiseley - home and away? Why not single out Lewis Guy's excellent winner on a grim Tuesday night at Edgeley Park? How about the splendid away win at Solihull? The hammering of Chorley? Aaron Taylor's penalty save? Take away any of those key moments and we would have finished second. I suspect if that HAD happened it would have suited you better, because failure would have given you something tangible hang your tiresome pessimism on. Does Barrow AFC actually winning something really make you feel that uncomfortable? Only someone with a pathological obsession with the negative side of everything Barrow AFC do would choose to nominate Omar Bogle as the player who "won" the Conference North title. Go and find another club's forum to moan on. How about Telford's - they're having a REALLY gloomy time of it.

Bogles penalty won us the league.

Simple as that.

I won't hear anything else on the subject

[spirit of 1990]

I don't think the football is as bad as people make out.

Jim, it really can be as bad as people are making out. That first half yesterday was really terrible, the whole game the other week wasn't much better.

I can accept to a degree the lack of quality football week-in-week-out, but I cant accept the way they sometimes look like they cant be arsed.
Two years ago players weren't getting paid and as people pointed out - that was bound to affect the way they performed on the pitch. There are no such problems this time around so what's wrong?
If a player is having a bad game they can at least make up for that by just putting the effort in (anyone can do that) but sometimes it doesn't look like they do. Edmo hinted at that yesterday, if they're not pulling their weight - get shot of them.....before the boss gets rid of you.

[russell_anderson]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ekbw1e098g

Blimey. Talk about a missing defence!

[Esso Blue]

When Solihull came to HS last season we were winning 1-0 when Bogle scored 2 goals to take them to 1-2 in a game that finished 1-3.
You can argue therefore that Bogle took 3 points from us.
It's a fatuous argument either way.

[The Real Slim Azza]

When Solihull came to HS last season we were winning 1-0 when Bogle scored 2 goals to take them to 1-2 in a game that finished 1-3.
You can argue therefore that Bogle took 3 points from us.
It's a fatuous argument either way.

Bogle won us the league

[Jim]

I don't think the football is as bad as people make out.

Jim, it really can be as bad as people are making out. That first half yesterday was really terrible, the whole game the other week wasn't much better.

I can accept to a degree the lack of quality football week-in-week-out, but I cant accept the way they sometimes look like they cant be arsed.
Two years ago players weren't getting paid and as people pointed out - that was bound to affect the way they performed on the pitch. There are no such problems this time around so what's wrong?
If a player is having a bad game they can at least make up for that by just putting the effort in (anyone can do that) but sometimes it doesn't look like they do. Edmo hinted at that yesterday, if they're not pulling their weight - get shot of them.....before the boss gets rid of you.

Agreed that something is wrong. The team that started yesterday was the same as the one that apparently put in a committed performance a few days ago at Macclesfield, apart from one enforced change. From the pre match interview, it was clear that Edmo had drummed into them the need to start at a high tempo and not to take things for granted. So if the same team, after being reminded by the manager to come out of the blocks quickly, fails to do so, where does the fault lie, players or manager? Is there an attitude problem or a fear of failure when expectations are high?

[Moonwatcher]

When Solihull came to HS last season we were winning 1-0 when Bogle scored 2 goals to take them to 1-2 in a game that finished 1-3.
You can argue therefore that Bogle took 3 points from us.
It's a fatuous argument either way.

Nice one. Wish I'd thought of that...

[barrowfan]

I don't think the football is as bad as people make out.

Jim, it really can be as bad as people are making out. That first half yesterday was really terrible, the whole game the other week wasn't much better.

I can accept to a degree the lack of quality football week-in-week-out, but I cant accept the way they sometimes look like they cant be arsed.
Two years ago players weren't getting paid and as people pointed out - that was bound to affect the way they performed on the pitch. There are no such problems this time around so what's wrong?
If a player is having a bad game they can at least make up for that by just putting the effort in (anyone can do that) but sometimes it doesn't look like they do. Edmo hinted at that yesterday, if they're not pulling their weight - get shot of them.....before the boss gets rid of you.

Spot on and Jim - it IS that bad.

[Moonwatcher]

Jim, it really can be as bad as people are making out. That first half yesterday was really terrible, the whole game the other week wasn't much better.

I can accept to a degree the lack of quality football week-in-week-out, but I cant accept the way they sometimes look like they cant be arsed.
Two years ago players weren't getting paid and as people pointed out - that was bound to affect the way they performed on the pitch. There are no such problems this time around so what's wrong?
If a player is having a bad game they can at least make up for that by just putting the effort in (anyone can do that) but sometimes it doesn't look like they do. Edmo hinted at that yesterday, if they're not pulling their weight - get shot of them.....before the boss gets rid of you.

Spot on and Jim - it IS that bad.

I don't subscribe to that. We are in a comfortable mid-table position, having played some terrible football and some good football. For every abject performance, there has been one that has been good, half decent or spoiled by individual errors. I'm not defending the indefensible, they have been awful at times, the summer recruiting has been deeply disappointing, and I scratch my head wondering what Edmo is thinking as much as the next man. I'm just trying to get a bit of perspective. This is an infuriating squad of players, and I stand by what I've said time and again on here - they CAN play decent football, I just can't figure out why they often choose not to.

[pjdaly]

Let me make it clear: I can’t stand Jose Mourhino. I often think a prison sentence would not be too strong a punishment for a bloke who routinely wrecks lives and careers, whether it be referees, physios or whoever. That notwithstanding, there can be no denying he knows how to be successful so I was interested in a comment he made yesterday and it was as follows: “They choose some matches to sweat blood and in other matches they don’t. That’s typical of an attitude of a team that wins nothing.” He was apparently referring to Newcastle. Seems true to me, for over a period of decades Newcastle have mastered the art of inconsistency, despite having amongst the biggest gates and the most impassioned fans.

That quote could however be aimed at any number of clubs, and it is true of us at Barrow. We have seen some dead-leg performances this season, notably against Southport (where only a wonder save at the end got us the three points), Aldershot, and now Kidderminster. But there again, we have seen performances against Eastleigh and Lincoln which were tremendous. I agree with an earlier post which said the real disconcerting thing about yesterday was not so much the penalties (awful though they were, perhaps we can put it down to just being two of those things) as the non-show in the first 45. Why were we not on the pitch in the first 45? Nobody’s going to pretend that we are great (by this league’s standards) but we ARE better than we sometimes appear. So what are they going to do to get a bit more consistency, to get the sweating of blood in every match? To return to the quote, which players have the necessary attitude and which haven’t? In the close season, the management were saying that they weren’t just looking at ability levels but also at what sort of characters the potential signings were! Perhaps they need to look again and check more thoroughly.

As for the penalties, they were woeful strikes. Walker has proved himself to be a good penalty taker but who else is there? Despite Cook being our player of the season thus far, and despite his wonder strike yesterday, I wouldn’t have him down as the cleanest striker of a football. Of the current bunch, the purest striker of a ball would be Ashton in my view. He seems a bit of a Rolls-Royce the way he puts his foot through the ball. Of course, purity of strike isn’t everything, he would need to want to take them and have the confidence to take them. Strangely enough, when I think of some of the purest strikers of a ball in our non-league days so many of them have been left full-backs! I’m thinking of Maurice Whittle, Tony Chilton (yes, for all his faults, Chilts could “ping” a ball) and possibly the best of them all, Scott Maxfield. Whatever, this should be sorted in training and there should be a crystal-clear rota, or order for taking spot-kicks, depending on who is on the pitch.

As for Symington, was he partly at fault for their goal yesterday? I don’t know the answer to that. Was he upfield as part of a strategy or was he just out of position of his own making? Only the team and management can answer that. However, if we pass on that one moment of the game yesterday I would say that otherwise he did nothing wrong the rest of the match and played well enough. The real problem yesterday was the absence of a midfield. That’s not to say Symington is an answer, just to present a more balanced perspective on where the problems truly lay yesterday and to counter some of the lazy scapegoating that can take off quicker than a forest fire. Despite Symington doing alright, what I want to see is us trying to get George Williams signed up for the rest of the season.

[K-Man]

Another weak goal let in by Dixon.