Open letter to the Forum

[barrowaberdeen]

I did not see what happened in the bar after the game but no one should be harassed as you appear to have been, one of the problems with the board at the moment is their desire to leave but only when they get their money back Brian and Tony Keen have both said that as has Dave Ryder and Keith Allen is unsure of what to do, this is not healthy for the club, I am sure if all the right documents were put in place none of these should have any worries as to if they will get any money back eventually, but there does seem to many not much at board level has been done in the close season, take the pitch I believe nothing had been done on it till a week before the first friendly, yet they knew it had to be done, then we have the shirts again why ! the commercial side has simply disappeared, as I say it is not good when most of the directors do not want to be there.

That would explain a lot and is what many have suspected for a while mainly based on the low profile and indifference emanating from the top and the serious lack of commercial push for the last year or so. I also suspect that Tony K and John Mack are busting their guts trying to run the operation between them which must be stressful. It’s a pity that John has terminated his Forum postings as we seem to be drifting back to the old us and them relationship despite all the good things we have achieved via this Forum.

I think the collective agreement from our perspective is that the BoDs need more people and there are those genuinely willing to help the BoDs if this help can be harnessed properly by Tony and John who are putting in some serious graft but still being roundly criticised. I for one am very grateful for their efforts, and the commitment of the Board members who previously put their cash into the club.

However, change is now desperately required and barring the intervention of some ‘mystery investor’ a larger roster of Directors is a must who in turn must seek reliable volunteers from the membership to delegate tasks to and report progress back – not try and do everything themselves.

Exactly. That's what the problem is in the OP and your reply is what needs to happen. But then others need to know what is owed and to whom, exactly. Otherwise how can anyone understand and help?

[optomisticsupporter]

Totally agree with Barrowaberdeen but Tony Keen due to work commitments is now going to spend lots of time in Canada which does not help at all, I also think we should know exactly what each director is owed by the club, this should be made clear at the AGM. and whether the loans are secured as Brian Keen's is or not.

[barrowaberdeen]

Yep, what's the procedure for asking the following, particularly in the light of the 'discussions regarding the constitution' or whatever it's called?

1) How much is each director owed, exactly?

2) What are the loans secured against? What are the terms of the loans?

3) What would really happen (and this isn't any sort of rabble rousing, but it affects moving forward) if any of those presently owed money were not elected to the board?

There's got to be some firm understanding of where this whole system of trying to shore up a members club with loans has got us. Also, we need to show a bit of respect and understanding for folk who work hard, unpaid for a club they care a lot about, same as us, and often get a load of shite flung their way, right or wrong.

However, the phrase in that statement "only a small part of my role" re fan liason is symptomatic of the closing of ranks within the club. It was probably unfair to give John a role which he probably didn't much fancy, and also it isn't exactly what UEFA guidelines suggest. I'll dig out the link if anyone cares- but basically it's meant to be someone elected or appointed from the fans who represents the support's perspective re policing, stewarding, pricing, travel etc. Perhaps a compromise is that if Pete G is elected, he could fulfil the role,- just a thought.

[Jonty]

Since the redevlopment fizzled out, it seems to me that the board and fans have lost sight of where we are going. The board need to set a new strategy and some new targets to aim for.

I would like to see a new longer term vision set out for the club and a plan in place with objectives clearly defined. This is where we are now- this is where we want to be (1/3/5 years), this is how we are going to get there, with measures of success identified so performance can be measured. How can we measure how good / bad / indifferent we are doing if we haven't even defined any measures of success? Basic business stuff right?


No wonder we always come back to the same arguments. The present board is too small and all the common complaints can be tied back to a small board trying to do everything. They need to get on with doing strategic board stuff - ie securing new investments, securing new sposnsorships, securing football foundation funding for floodlights etc, and let others do the everyday management.

[John Very Little]

Agree with all that Wintergreen, barrowaberdeen and Jonty says, if you can dig out that link can you post it on here or PM me Steve?

FWIW the last accounts showed that we had 122K of directors loans outstanding, 76K of that was to BK's company St Andrews Engineering secured against the ground. Some existing and former directors have also given guarentees as additional security against the mortgage. The accounts at the AGM will generally be around 9 months out of date which is a problem in that we don't see what the present position is with regard to some of the things that are happening such as directors loans. I think the only way we'll find out that information is if someone asks a question at the AGM or submits a question if they are unable to attend. TK did mention that directors had put in 250K of loans at the last AGM to keep the club going but how much and to whom wasn't divulged but I'd expect most of the current directors will have put something in.

Its a shame that JM has decided to take the action he has as any form of communication from the club is helpful.
I suspect that the state the club is in financially may have meant that we are paying off bills from last season instead of paying for things like replica shirts and the groundsman? If this has been the case the club should tell us this sort of info at the AGM if only to explain why things haven't happened as they should? It won't excuse everything but it would help us understand as I think the members deserve some explanation?

[The Real Slim Azza]

John.

You strike me as very childish.


Cheers,

Az

[bluebird90]

Its my ball and I'm taking it home!

[frankums]

I really don't blame John in all fairness as its IMO getting
Beyond a joke the attacks on people on the forum,
We all have a part to play but some just seem intent
On attacking others or the bod or the club,
I agree that something needs to be done
And that we lack leadership at the top.

I don't really spend a lot of time on here
Now as you spell something incorrect someone's on it,
Or some poster has been on here longer
And seem to think there opinion is better,

We do ourselfs no faves at all and push away
Our own kind,
Don't really get it to be honest

If this is a sonnet it's a line short.

[thegaffer77]

Again during a conversation with Forum Members in the Cross Bar last night on several occasions when I made a statement I was told I was liar and after several such occasions I walked away from the discussion. Following this and the other occasions on the Forum I have decided that from now on I will continue to inform fans but it will only be through the Official Club Website as all club news should be. I will no longer place any news items on the Forum nor will I be answering any questions placed on the Forum as I no longer wish to be associated with a media that is used to attack me or my fellow volunteers.

They are not only forum members but valued supporters. You should not be getting abused from anyone for your work. However, give us the news, let us help and do not tar everyone with the same brush. We are one family and every family has a few idiots in.

[capman]

What a load off shit why are they we just want two no what is going on with the club it is going down the pan

[thegaffer77]

What a load off [SwearFilter] why are they we just want two no what is going on with the club it is going down the pan

If abuse is occurring then they should have a word with themselves. Read again, I don't agree with this outburst either.

[John Very Little]

If we are going to have things mentioned on the Official Website then I would have thought that players joining and leaving the club would be mentioned?
No news that we've signed Jary Bitner (mentioned on the Conference site on Tuesday) or that both Cliff Moyo and Robin Hulbert have left the club.
Surely this is the sort of thing that should be mentioned on the Official Website?

[Reg]

If we are going to have things mentioned on the Official Website then I would have thought that players joining and leaving the club would be mentioned?
No news that we've signed Jary Bitner (mentioned on the Conference site on Tuesday) or that both Cliff Moyo and Robin Hulbert have left the club.
Surely this is the sort of thing that should be mentioned on the Official Website?

John

It's very clear that nobody at board level gives much of a [SwearFilter] about this kind of thing anymore.

It's more surprising when news is actually posted on that thing, than it is when it isn't

[ruins]

We need a contact between the board and fans. Pete would be ideal, Dave ayres kind of did that didn't he.?

Any business needs a contact like that. John has bailed IMO and the club is driving fans away. Yesterday opened my eyes a lot. A couple of Bradford pa fans we were all talking to said they thought barrow were surprisingly shit. Surprisingly ? A few players came and spoke to us, nice. Brian was his normal self when I asked him about the first half, to quote "well I haven't seen you at games for a while, how can you comment?" Which is a fair point now I live in chorley but he was more interested in buying a drink for a bpa player than listening to me.

And someone threw up in front of the whole of the world.
.

[The Chief]

as a member of a members club I think the board should reflect the membership....this is not the case presently. BK from the start, said we would be "squeaky clean" its been a closed shop much akin to the masons for as long as I can remember, the success covered up the blaringly obvious incompetence for a while but we have made errors time and again, in 1999 we could forgive this as they had saved the club and were learning how to be a football board, but 14 years later we havent gone anywhere further forward as a club, we are still commericially shambolic, disorganised and going backwards fast. how some of these guys have been successful in business is beyond me!

we need a change, we need fresh impetus and we need it fast.

how many times have agms been late? accounts been late? bills been late? shirts been late? the list goes on.

sack theboard and start again.