Ian Evatt

[Electricblues]

If I were Ian Evatt my first question to BW's would be 'why do you not think I'm worth anything like what my current employer thinks I'm worth'?

[DaveP]

I think another stumbling block for Bolton is the 28000 + capacity stadium they need to run and the fact of where it is.

Gates are falling anyway but having lived around Greater Manchester for a very long time now I know many Bolton fans deserted when the stadium moved albeit the Premier league status kept quite a few but the fact is the stadium is isolated away from Bolton town centre and I really believe they face nothing but struggle.

Good luck to IE if offered a "step up" but for me Bolton is a car crash he would be best staying away from.

[andyg]

Firstly, seems to me Stephen that you think IE will probably leave reading through your comments. If that is so then I hope he does well but I can't help feeling IE would do better waiting a little longer as I think there maybe bigger and more stable clubs that might come along. He's only been a manager for two years. I get everything you say but is Bolton a risk worth taking for IE at this moment in time? Only IE will be able to answer that.
Secondly, and here again I betray my age, but this is certainly not a first for Barrow. Back in 1967 Don McEvoy after steering us to our only promotion in the football league resigned to become manager of Grimsby. The club was shook particularly has he just reinforced the team by signing such players as David Storf on the wing (a great player only 23 from Rochdale) and Terry MacDonald at full back. But the best signing Barrow did was appoint Colin Appleton as our new manager. Over the next 18 months he took Barrow up to the higher regions of Division 3 until ill health forced him to step back from the managers position. We all know what happened after that. The point is if IE goes then the most important signing we need to make is the new manager. Preferably a young one with the vision both Evatt and Appleton possess. That is what is crucial for the clubs progress. But I hope Ian stays a bit longer!

[Suffolk Blue]

There is some very naive and ill thought out comments on here who obviously have no idea how football works.

Brutal - but true. Perhaps not the time to ram it down the throats of fans who have every right to persist with a rather more romantic view though?

Whatever the outcome, this is the almost certainly the beginning of the end I think for IEs tenure at Barrow. In fact I think that process started at the back end of last year. Success since then has clouded judgements a bit, and that's to be expected.

So the issues with Bolton are probably not about ambition or opportunity or potential. In the eyes of those that matter those arguments have been lost and will stay lost. I'm pretty sure that since the Fylde experience the Board have been aware of all of this and that oddly thanks to the predatory behaviour of the Fylde Chairman a strategy has been developed that is now playing out.

The issues with Bolton are purely technical/financial therefore. They are not about keeping IE at all costs they are about not getting screwed. Had this been any other L2 club - a Mansfield or a Walsall the deal might have been done by now. What is stopping it is not so much our refusal to part with IE but our distrust (quite rightly) of the institution that is currently Bolton Wanderers. If we were to retain IE it would only be because of a failure of faith in Bolton's ability to pay.

Hopefully that's the more gentle interpretation of SLs post.

… and just to emphasise how cautious we should be in accepting offers of compensation, there was something else that occurred to me about the compensation amount for IE. Not only are Bolton under a transfer embargo of course but they are also subject to Financial Fair Play rules regarding the level of debt that they are allowed to carry over as proportion of income/turnover.

Assuming that the compensation fee was of the order say even of £150k I would doubt very much that such a sum was available from within the clubs current account financing. It just doesn't have the liquidity. So the only way that it could fund that amount may well be a loan from the parent company (FV). That in itself will draw attention to the means by which the club is being funded and I would guess have to be disguised as something other than a loan - to avoid appearing in the books as a loss which it effectively is. No doubt Paul Hornby could tell us how to do it though.

This is one of the reasons Bolton probably have to try for a payment schedule without much up front costs. It is also therefore the most likely reason why this deal will fall though. For all its attractions as a club, its size, its facilities its history, financially Wanderers are very high risk.

[barrowfan]

I think the role of Evatt's agent has a lot to do with this. He obviously wants his wedge of the £250,000 and it looks like Bolton don't pay agents, so his fee will have to be paid by Evo.

No doubt his agent also benefitted when his new contract was negotiated, so I really admire the stance of Paul Hornby - "if you want our manager, it's going to cost you". Stick to your guns Paul!

[andyg]

The other factor to take into account is will there be significant manager upheavals in L1 & L2 later in the summer once relegation (from the championship)and play off promotions have been settled.

[Stephen Leonard]

There is some very naive and ill thought out comments on here who obviously have no idea how football works.

Brutal - but true. Perhaps not the time to ram it down the throats of fans who have every right to persist with a rather more romantic view though?

So you agree with me but suggest I shouldn't mention it to avoid offending those that don't? Common sense, level headedness and logic not required on here? If you analyse most of the posts on this thread they are not being romantic they are simply slagging off Bolton and saying Evatt would be stupid to go there.

By selecting one line you miss the whole point of the post which was to explain how I see things from the point of Evatt, Bolton and Barrow - surely better to have some viewpoint other than 'Bolton are crap and no longer a big club'?

If Evatt doesn't go now then he will eventually - and the same arguments and comments will come on here and the same logic that I posted will still apply.

Romance is great in football and the vote last week meaning we are in L2 is an example of that. This situation with Evatt and Bolton is a harsh reality lesson that football sadly not a romantic game its a business and people within it make business decisions that best suit their circumstances (thats players, managers and owners) -

I also pointed out that whilst losing Evatt now would be a major blow - it might also be the best time for it to happen so we can build with someone who will possibly be here in 2/3 years time. I suspect that Paul Hornby and the other owners will be already planning for that situation as they are shrewd enough to know that Evatt is either going now or shortly and they need to get the best for this club out of that situation.

I make no apology for being a realist.

[the ray wilkie stand]

BBC manchester reporting bolton unwilling to bid more than 100k. If that's the case and we stand firm bolton will have to look elsewhere.

[Nigel Bamford]

As for the player embargo and financial issues - yes thats a possible stumbling block to realising the potential but if any manager is convinced that those issues will be resolved over the next 12 months and that a 3/4 year contract is dangled then it might be tempting enough to go for it. Also it means that the repuatation of a manager is protected slightly from failing as they can turn round and say 'well i tried as hard as I could but the limitations meant I couldn't build the squad I wanted to and I was given false promises'

Which tarnishes your star less: managing Barrow to National League promotion and then a respectable 10/12th in L2 (as per your earlier post) or taking the Bolton job, finding it isn't easy with all the constraints and then blaming everything and the cat for your bad judgement in going there? You pays yer money, you takes yer choice. He would have to be very, very certain he had the opportunity to realise this perceived potential but, at the moment, the evidence suggests they haven't got the proverbial pot to pee in.

[Hadrian]

Bolton are not allowed to pay a fee for any player until summer 2021!

Hence, perhaps, the appeal of a driven, ambitious and successful manager with a little black book of transfer and loan targets already prepared for another League 2 club that would be unlikely to pay transfer fees anyway?

A manager whose first appointment was a data analyst who appears to have been an essential component of Barrow's success these last two seasons then from an application/interview process appointed an assistant 'out of nowhere' who also appears to have proved a gem and appointed a Head Therapist whom he knew at Chesterfield who appears to have had an impact in reducing long-term injuries to players.

Not a bad little package for a club to access for a quarter of a million pounds.

If a club has a quarter of a million pounds to spend, of course.

[andyg]

If we are all talking about these issues I'm sure IE has being weighing them up carefully over the past few days. It is a critical choice for him to make and one that could certainly affect the rest of his career. I'm sure someone like me doesn't need to tell IE that!

[Jonty]

We have a career manager at the helm, so wants to progress, if he thinks that is with Bolton then fine, the club wont block that, but they have to pay up!! Coming in short feels like big club syndrome to me....so well done to the club for not backing down on it.

The big question, What happens if it all falls through, I’m not sure what to think. Every manager casualty that happens he will be in the frame. We have to bear that in mind and I don't think that is something the club need when we are trying to build something here.

[Stephen Leonard]

As for the player embargo and financial issues - yes thats a possible stumbling block to realising the potential but if any manager is convinced that those issues will be resolved over the next 12 months and that a 3/4 year contract is dangled then it might be tempting enough to go for it. Also it means that the repuatation of a manager is protected slightly from failing as they can turn round and say 'well i tried as hard as I could but the limitations meant I couldn't build the squad I wanted to and I was given false promises'

Which tarnishes your star less: managing Barrow to National League promotion and then a respectable 10/12th in L2 (as per your earlier post) or taking the Bolton job, finding it isn't easy with all the constraints and then blaming everything and the cat for your bad judgement in going there? You pays yer money, you takes yer choice. He would have to be very, very certain he had the opportunity to realise this perceived potential but, at the moment, the evidence suggests they haven't got the proverbial pot to pee in.

The thing is none of us know which way it will play out for either club - we could storm the league or be battling relegation or nicely safe in the middle - and Bolton could be any of those as well .

If you are ambitious you have to weigh up the risks and potential rewards of any decision like this - either way could end up making you a bigger hero or ruining your reputation. I just think that most managers in football are risk takers and accept the posssible downsides much more than people in other sectors (mainly because being sacked is sort of inevitable for most)

My point was around why Evatt would want to speak to Bolton to find out what the offer was to answer the point of why he just doesn’t say he doesn’t want to go.

I guess I just have a completely different take on this situation than most people

[Suffolk Blue]

Brutal - but true. Perhaps not the time to ram it down the throats of fans who have every right to persist with a rather more romantic view though?

So you agree with me but suggest I shouldn't mention it to avoid offending those that don't? Common sense, level headedness and logic not required on here? If you analyse most of the posts on this thread they are not being romantic they are simply slagging off Bolton and saying Evatt would be stupid to go there.

By selecting one line you miss the whole point of the post which was to explain how I see things from the point of Evatt, Bolton and Barrow - surely better to have some viewpoint other than 'Bolton are crap and no longer a big club'?

If Evatt doesn't go now then he will eventually - and the same arguments and comments will come on here and the same logic that I posted will still apply.

Romance is great in football and the vote last week meaning we are in L2 is an example of that. This situation with Evatt and Bolton is a harsh reality lesson that football sadly not a romantic game its a business and people within it make business decisions that best suit their circumstances (thats players, managers and owners) -

I also pointed out that whilst losing Evatt now would be a major blow - it might also be the best time for it to happen so we can build with someone who will possibly be here in 2/3 years time. I suspect that Paul Hornby and the other owners will be already planning for that situation as they are shrewd enough to know that Evatt is either going now or shortly and they need to get the best for this club out of that situation.

I make no apology for being a realist.

I selected the one line Stephen simply to save space. And I reiterate I agree with your comments though your tone does feel a bit angry though I certainly wasn't suggesting an apology.

I would actually go further and admit that if Bolton could be trusted to stump up the compensation in one amount, Id be very tempted to take it and go and buy myself a name with a decent reputation at this level. I would actually see that as progress despite not wanting to lose Evatts skill set.

However, Bolton's financial position here is very relevant and is about as abnormal as it gets before it leaves the realms of the EFL and enters the realms of the FCA. In fact its actually worse in some ways than Macclesfield's who's funding or lack of it at least derives from the pockets of one individual. Bolton, a business with virtually no apparent independent financial liquidity are being kept afloat by another company who's expertise, core business strength and self-professed priorities lay in hospitality.

So my guess is that the reason for the delay is that Bolton are unable to negotiate a financial settlement that does not leave us, a club run by a very good accountant, open to financial risk. Even if I wanted to ship the manager out, I would not be prepared to do so under those circumstances. The problem in all of this is and has always been Bolton Wanderers.

[Leo]

My take is that while Evatt is probably not overly loyal to the club, he respects the club and owners hugely. When his new contract was signed it was done in good faith, and an acknowledgment that the release clause would be adhered to by both sides. Thus the board would not stand in his way if a club was willing to put up the cash, but likewise Evatt wouldnt throw his toys out if they were interested but unwilling to do so.

Thus Evatt is likely very interested in the Bolton job, but respects us, the owners and the club in general to see this one through if Bolton can't or won't pay